1.7 Dark Horse

With Lachie Pringle

Lachie Pringle and Bronte Charlotte chat about Lachie’s young career in theatre, film and music, the daunting reality of attending drama school in another state straight out of high school, and suddenly becoming the lead singer of a successful indie rock band in Sydney, Australia. They also delve into Lachie’s thoughts on diversity and representation in the arts industry as a mixed race actor.

Lachie performs his original song ‘Wrong,’ which he wrote at a time when he was feeling discouraged by the kinds of people that were in positions of power in Australia and around the world. He was dabbling in political rap at the time so this piece is an experiment with a genre Lachie previously had had no songwriting experience in.

During this episode we discuss:

• [03:39] VCA in moments: First year and self reflection, second year and animal studies, third year and Company 18’s Australian Play Readings

• [13:38] Lachie’s journey from high school to drama school to starting the successful indie rock band The Tints, moving interstate and how it can affect your relationships, and being dubbed Dark Horse

• [22:43] LAchie’s experience as a mixed race actor, the need for more diverse storytelling and representation on our stages and screens, and how we all deal differently with our racial identity

• [31:31] How consistency and a daily practice can work for some but not for everyone, creating an honest character through research, and the joy of creativity

• [38:54] Wrong by Lachie Pringle

• [44:36] GET ON IT: The Trauma Cleaner by Sarah Krasnostein

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Bronte:
This is Chats with Creatives, a podcast where we talk about living as creative humans in a capitalist society, the experiences we have and insecurities we hold, a place where we have open and inclusive conversations to learn, understand, educate and connect. My name is Bronte and this is Dark Horse with Lachie Pingle. Lachie is an actor and musician from Sydney, Australia. We went to the VCA together in Melbourne and since graduating Lachie has moved back to Sydney, where his band The Tints have been making waves in the indie music scene. He's an incredibly talented performer. His voice is smooth like honey and he is one of the most charismatic, relaxed and handsome men I have come across in this industry. We talk a lot about our experience at the VCA... We had some really weird assessments that we ended up doing together, which is always a lot of fun to reminisce about so hopefully you find a little bit of joy in this chat like we did. It was such a treat to talk to Lachie. He is so full of joy and ease and honesty. And we have some important conversations about Lachie's experience as a mixed race actor working in the creative industries. I would like to acknowledge just before we begin that I'm recording this podcast on the stolen lands of the Wurundjeri People of the Kulin Nation. If there are any Indigenous listeners today, thank you so much for being here. Let's get started. How are you this morning, Lachie Pringle?

Lachie:
I'm good. Oh my God, how's Melbourne?

Bronte:
It's OK. You know... Lockdown life is just continuing. It's fucking freaky, though. I went to went to the shops the other day and it's so weird that everyone's in masks. I'm like, "oh wow. This is the society we live in right now."

Lachie:
That is super freaky. I feel like that's not the case in Sydney. Like in Sydney, not everyone is in a mask for obviously different reasons, like the situation is not as bad up here at the moment. But it's kind of like, I just feel like everyone should be taking precautionary action. Because I just feel like a second wave is just incoming. I just feel like, it's just going to happen and we're going to have to get off our high horse that we've been on for the last few weeks going, "if Melbourne could get their shit together and then maybe we could all move on." But then it's going to hit us and we're going to look like fools.

Bronte:
I think that's the thing. Like, I've got people in Queensland, my family's in Queensland and they keep being like, "what are you doing wrong down there?" I'm like, "it's just going to happen." Like, it just is. I mean, it may not... I mean, there may be a second wave in Sydney, you just don't know do you. Bloody, how's your morning been? What have you been up to so far at 10am in the morning?

Lachie:
You know, I'd love to say that I've just been for a beach run, and I've gone for a surf, and then I've kicked the footy, and then I've gone and had a acai bowl down at Bondi, and then you know, and by then it's like 6am, and then I've read a few chapters of my favourite book, and then I've gone for a swim. But that's not true. I've had a very chilled out morning, to be honest. This is the feature event of my morning. So, I've just sort of been prepping, making sure my mic works. I've been like, tuning my guitar and trying to warm up my voice!

Bronte:
Love it! Before each interview I'm like, "Pah Pah Pah..." and then I'm like, "oh nah, it's going to be whatever it's going to be."

Lachie:
Yeah you're like, "Let's test some sound levels. Pah Poo Pah Pawb..." It's going to be what it's going to be.

Bronte:
How did we meet, Lachie Pringle?

Lachie:
Oh, gee whiz. Well, short answer, the Victorian College of the Arts. Yeah. I mean, drama school. What else is there to say? First year was a ride. So I think we really just got to know each other in all sorts of different ways, whether they were fun or productive or not productive... synthesis. That's just a bit of an inside gag for the VCA alum out there.

So you and Sarah Fitzgerald and I - Sarah Fitzgerald was the first guest on the podcast - every time... We kind of had a chat the other day about like the bubble that we're in, in terms of like, being in the leftists, kind of, arts community in Melbourne. And I was like, "it's such a bubble." And both of us were like, *gasp* like totally, totally triggered by that synthesis assessment we did.

Lachie:
Yes. Just so everyone is aware, that was a, me and Bronte were part of a six person group performance, it was like a devising group performance, and essentially there just was no... I didn't even know what the brief was the whole time. I still don't really know what it was. It was like make a piece, make a ten minute piece of theatre. And so we all just...

Bronte:
But it was like about your experience at VCA in the first 12 weeks that we'd had or something.

Lachie:
Like, even that was just so broad, it was like... I feel like we felt like we wanted to do more than just our experience at the VCA. That felt like a primary school project. It felt like, "this was my semester at the VCA." And so we sort of...

Bronte:
And it was. Ours was about bubbles.

Lachie:
But we also tried to incorporate elements of, you know, our broader sort of focus in the world and life. But it just ends up becoming just this muddled mess of things with different concepts. And then, I don't know.

Bronte:
It's so funny. I feel like that kind of assessment is almost too self reflective. It's like, really look at what you've... And it's very self-involved rather than looking out at what's happening in the world around you. I struggled with that because I was like, "fuck I don't want to think about the last 15 weeks for ME in this crazy bubble that it's been. I want to look outward or look forward rather than reflect in front of an audience."

Lachie:
Yeah. I felt like we just spent a whole semester just looking deeper and deeper at ourselves. And I was like, "Okay, that's enough. I want to just read a script now written by someone else and do some acting."

Bronte:
Do you have a really fond memory of the VCA? I mean, there's so many, but is there something that encompasses it.

Lachie:
Oh, encompasses... honestly I don't know about encompasses, but my favourite memory of the VCA was pretty much the final thing that we did there, apart from Showcase. And it was when we did our Australian play readings and it was fully student run. And once again we were working together. There were five shows over five nights, all directed by a member of our company. And we cast ourselves and honestly, I think not to discredit the amazing teachers that we had in the VCA because like, you know, we had some rippers... Just the ownership that we had during that whole process and the texts that we chose, I just felt like I was like, at that point we were making theatre that was relevant to a modern Australian audience. Which, not to quote from your chat with Sarah, which I listened to the other day, but we didn't do a lot of that. We didn't do a lot of, yeah relevant work that felt like the audience that was coming to see it was going to, you know, change them or something.

Bronte:
That project that we ran, like our whole company was so invested in it and so passionate about it. And I think it really was because we were like, "let's do the work that is relevant to us." Everything was written after the 1950s, Australian writers, some of it was new work, like it was just what we wanted. And the piece that we chose was just so intense. It was Andrew Bovell, Things I Know To Be True. Which is beautiful. But I think, the thing that got me was at the end, I'm not going to spoil the piece but something really upsetting happens to one of the characters, and I think because so many people in our company were there in the audience, it felt very real... And it was like this combination of, people we love in our company and also a story about family, and everyone has that kind of... sorry. Everyone has that... go on...

Lachie:
Just for context Bronte's cat is currently walking across the desk.

Bronte:
Dominating, dominating the camera.

Lachie:
I wasn't laughing at your description of the beautiful text, it just the cat appeared. Anyway. This is an audio medium, not a visual medium. So, lets get back to it.

Bronte:
Nobody will find that amusing or entertaining in any way, shape or form. Yeah, just that combination of family and it being us and a very close knit group of people. It just became like very emotional.

Lachie:
Yeah, definitely. I remember when we first read it just doing the reading. I hadn't read the play before. I hadn't seen the play before. So I was kind of just thrown in. I remember I was like, I think I was one of the last people of that group to sort of come in. Ed was like, "Oh, there's this Australian dad character." And I was like, "say no more, fam!" I was like, "this is the only chance I'm going to get for 50 years to play my dream role of Australian dad." There was just something about it that I loved and then I was just enjoying playing that character, and I thought it was a fun, light-hearted play about Australian suburban family life. And then, my God, the ending just crept up on me. And I think a lot of us out of nowhere.

Bronte:
Yeah, I mean, in the reading, I'm pretty sure all of us were crying.

Lachie:
Yeah, just reading it. And it was like, man, it's moments like that you realize this is, like this is worth putting on, you know.

Bronte:
I have this memory... I've had a few VCA guests, and not all of it has been reminiscing, but for some reason you and I have been in some really weird shit together. Not even on purpose, like synthesis was just a time. And then we both were doing lions' in our animal studies. And I was just thinking one night, I was like, "fuck this. I don't want to be a lion on my own. I want to be with another lion."

I literally forgot about that until the other day, but that was also just a great time. And for me... OK, so like, when I first came to VCA and pretty much the whole time throughout VCA, my least favourite class was movement classes. Just because, I don't know what it was about it, I'm yeah, I don't know, I much prefer working with text and stuff and sometimes looking at my body and sort of how it's made up and trying to - not change it - but just kind of figure it out, can be very confronting for me. So movement classes were always like my least favourite thing. But that animal study, I think if I didn't have another lion to just be lion-ing around with... Like I wasn't sort of looking inward at myself for that project, it was sort of just like, "what can my lion do here to compliment Bronte's lion? And what would they... What are they doing together?" It was really just like improv. Just be the lion and it's all going to work out because Bronte is up here as well.

Bronte:
That's essentially how we rehearsed the assessment. We got together for like half an hour and we were like, "so, let's just be lions for a bit..."

Lachie:
We didn't really talk about it, like in a good way, we didn't have to like, choreograph anything or be like, "let's do this..."

Bronte:
Apart from the lion sex scene.

Lachie:
Apart from the lion sex scene, which we made sure... That was probably the only discussion that we had. We were like, "OK, Rinsky Ginsburg, our movement teacher, is going to love this."

Bronte:
She's going to love it. Because... literally though, I watched like four lion documentaries for this assessment. I know so much about Lions now, but the only thing they do is like sleep, eat and have sex. That's all they do. Sometimes they fight, but mostly they're just sleeping, eating and banging.

Lachie:
Good on them. It's good work if you can get it.

Bronte:
Oh, so good. One of those classic moments, thinking about Rinsky's movement classes... It was must have been our first movement class in second year, and all through first year we'd kind of spent a lot of time on the floor, kind of, I would explain my time at VCA being like, "we roll around on the floor learning how to be babies, essentially." How babies move and then how the human form moves. And in our first class in second year, Rinsky got us to lie on our backs and use our shoulder blades to roll us along the floor. And I was like, "this. This is the typical drama school moment that I thought was never coming. And here it is. We're all just like trying to roll along the floor.

Lachie:
Now, that is an encapsulating moment.

Bronte:
That for me is just like, that's the drama school thing that people say is what happens at drama school and you're like, "nah, it doesn't." And then it happened and I was like, "okay, this is it. This is the moment."

Lachie:
That's the stuff that they're not putting on the ads. That's the stuff that's being emitted from the billboards for the University of Melbourne. Just the rolling on the floor with your shoulder blades and moments like that where you're just like, "wow, this is..." It's moments like that where I always felt like, "wow, this is a really extraordinary life that I'm living. That I'm doing this." Like this is, it's so random and crazy. But there are people who would go through their whole lives without ever rolling on their shoulder blades and trying to be like a baby. And even though at the time it just feels random and you're wondering what it's giving you or what you're getting from it... But, yeah, it's just such a unique experience. So I was always super thankful in a weird way for moments like that. Something to tick off the bucket list.

Bronte:
Ok, most serious questions now. Are you ready?

Lachie:
Probably not, but go!

Bronte:
Give us a little rundown of who you are and your history in the creative industries.

Lachie:
I am an actor and musician, occasionally a voiceover artist, and I got accepted into the VCA... not to go back to the VCA, I'm not going to last too long on that because we just discussed a whole bunch of it. I got accepted into the VCA after I auditioned when I was pretty much at the end of high school. Which at the time, I was like "sick! Great." But I think, I definitely went from being a big fish in a small pond, like, I was pretty much 'the guy who does drama' at an all boys private school. So like, big fish in a small pond in terms of theatre and drama, to being... First year I felt like a very little fish in a huge pond because I was just looking around and was like amazed by everyone. I was like, "damn, I have like no runs on the board, I have no experience or whatever." And then after graduating, I signed with my agent and I ended up moving up to Sydney almost immediately, which is not something that I thought I would do. So I'm originally from Sydney, but I moved back up. I had plans, I guess, kind of, to stay in Melbourne for longer, but then sort of, things just happened to that happened. My agent's based in Sydney, which was kind of, part of my thought process and then also I had the option to come up, take a break for a bit, live with the parents for a bit. Financially take some pressure off. And so things just ended up working out that way. And then stars kind of aligned in a way, because the month that I moved up to Sydney, my old buddies from school who I used to jam with, who had been in a band called Primrose for 2, 3... they were looking for a new project, they are a guitarist and a bass player, and were looking for a singer and a drummer. And so they hit me up basically after seeing that I moved back to Sydney and we basically just started jamming and it was superfluid. And then I got my friend Maya, who I used to... I used to play in a band with her in high school called The Lolly Pops. We didn't play a whole amount of serious gigs, but we played at like showcase nights and stuff like that for our music school. And she's just one of the sickest drummers that I've ever played with. So I was like, "would you be keen?" The band formed! And now we call ourselves The Tints. And yeah, we've got an EP out on Spotify now. At the moment we're not playing any gigs for obvious reasons. But, you know, momentum is kind of just building with every new release and gig and stuff. It's an exciting little time. It's an exciting little side quest that I didn't think I would have because I was pretty much coming out of drama school, like, "OK, I'm an actor." And I still you know, in Melbourne I busked all the time and played acoustic gigs at pubs if they would have me and stuff, but I didn't think I'd be playing in a band regularly releasing music on iTunes, Spotify. And, you know, taking it as seriously as I kind of am now. So that was just a fun little side quest that wouldn't have happened if I hadn't moved up to Sydney when I did, because Charles and Ben probably would have found, like they were just itching to get back into a band. But, you know, they would have found a singer and a drummer and stuff. So it was a little moment of stars aligning.

Bronte:
So The Tints is more a side project, than...?

Lachie:
Well, I mean, like I don't know. I guess, I shouldn't call it a side project, but I still do... I still do like, I consider myself an actor. And then if you, hey if we chat for long enough, you will discover that I'm in a band as well. And that's like, I don't really introduce myself as like, an actor/musician. I like, I don't know, I want to be known as an actor. And hey, if The Tints take off then that's great. But I'll always act. So I'm not like suddenly going to give one up. And if I got cast in some huge thing and I would still, if it was possible, still play with The Tints. So I don't have any plans to give one up ever really.

Bronte:
It's been so cool to watch The Tints, kind of, grow and you moving back to Sydney was like... you know, there were a few people in our company that moved away straight away, and it was kind of like, a big hit each time because it's like, "oh, that person that we've been with for 3 years is further away now than we thought they would be, than we kind of comprehended that that would happen." But it was so good to just watch The Tints grow and to see you expand. I mean, you've always, like it's not that you couldn't do it. It was just like, seeing it happen was like, "yes, that's so great." You know, Leith called you, our teacher Leith McPherson, called you a Dark Horse and it's so true. You just like, have all these skills and they just kind of like, grow and it's really cool to see The Tints do so well.

Lachie:
Good old Leith. I feel like that's something I should have mentioned when we were talking about VCA, is Leith McPherson. I think, you know, she's just one of those people that I think just comes into your life and things start making sense. I think things started to click for me in my practice, and as an actor, and as a performer, the moment that she started taking us regularly, whether it was for dialect stuff or whether it was, you know, acting classes. When we did our American accent scenes, I think that was when she gave me the title, Dark Horse. Which is something that I'm proud of as well, I guess, that she gave that, or just, you know, made a point of saying that to me, like I took it in a very complementary way. Because I knew that for the first part of VCA I think I was keeping a bit quiet or just didn't have as much confidence in myself as some of the other members of our company, to just sort of give it absolutely everything and I probably did hold back a bit. And I think it was, I put it down to her. Like I mean, I opened up throughout our Shakespeare workshop with her, and I was very jealous that you guys got to be directed by her for Henry V. Not that I don't love Budi Miller but I just have... Leith is like a soul connection, like a soul buddy, you know like... It's a different level, it's a different level of connection, more than a teacher. And I just, I think she needs to direct more things. She's an amazing dialect coach, best in the world, but she's also a phenomenal director.

Bronte:
It sounds like you kind of, like you say the stars aligned with The Tints, it sounds like you just kind of followed curiosity and where your path kind of took you with moving back to Sydney, and it just kind of... And even getting into the VCA like, you just moved to Melbourne. And then, I mean it's very, it's part of your character so much, that kind of like, relaxed go with the flow.

Lachie:
Hundred percent. Yeah, I think you can create your own luck if you keep your mind open to possibility. And that's kind of, that's what I've done for my whole life. Or at least since I stepped on a stage for the first time. Because I was a very shy kid and I was actually not very relaxed as a kid. And I think the stage... I did my first student theatre musical when I was 15, which is later, a lot later than a lot of people who pursue this sort of thing. And it relaxed me. It allowed me to start showing my music to other people because I was, you know, I used to write and make up songs as a kid. But it wasn't really until I began acting that I started thinking, "maybe, maybe I can perform music, as well, to people." And so they both sort of intertwined and helped each other out. And it's always been that very symbiotic relationship to me between music and drama, like one has helped the other. If I didn't have one, the other one would be left behind as well. So they've sort of helped each other the whole time. Yeah. And I guess, yeah, it's the same thing with The Tints. I came back to Sydney, got a message from Charles. I literally didn't ask any questions. He was just like, "do you want to come jam with us?" I was like, "absolutely." And I was like, "yeah, I'm absolutely keen. I'm just looking for things to do. And so let's just hang out."

Bronte:
How was that move for you? I mean, you moved to Melbourne straight out of high school and then you settled and found your place and then you had to move... Well, you didn't have to, but you did move straight back to Sydney. How did you kind of deal with that?

Lachie:
Yeah. Look, the first few months in Sydney were pretty tough. I was sort of like, every time I got a self type request or an audition request from my agent, I was just like... That got all of my attention because I was like, "oh, man. Like, I've got to, you know... I'm back here. I need to make it worth it because of sacrificed a lot." So I need to just go hard at everything and I think, I sacrificed a little bit of... like I didn't prioritize my social life during that period because I was like, "nah, I need to be focussed. I need to really just work hard all the time." And the tough thing for me was that I had already experienced what happens. So I moved to Melbourne straight out of high school. I wasn't very good at sort of staying in regular contact with all my Sydney friends when I moved down. I kind of just got caught up in the student village where I was living and then VCA. And so it was just these worlds that were just all encompassing. And so a lot of my high school friends, either didn't hear from me or I didn't hear from for a while. I became a lot less close with a lot of them. I guess the fear for me when I moved back to Sydney, was that... Was that it was going to happen again. And I'd sort of, you know... In Melbourne, the connections and friendships that I made in Melbourne were like, I can't lose them. Basically. Like they would, I would become, like that would destroy me, I think, if I lost some of them. So there was a huge amount of fear and I put a lot of pressure on myself because I was like, "yeah, you've moved up. This better be worth it."

Bronte:
And I was interested in you kind of, being back in Sydney, being able to spend a bit more time with your family... I'm really curious, have you been taking part in any Chinese traditions or is that something that you don't really connect with? Or like, just spending time with your grandparents who are... is it your grandparents who came from, who immigrated? Or is it further back?

Lachie:
Yeah, yep so... No, it's my, it's my mother's parents, but they immigrated from different places. So my mother's father came here from China and my mother's mother is from Italy, and she came over at the age of four at the end of the Second World War. I mean, for us in our family, I think Chinese New Year's is the big time where we sort of, really get in touch with our Chinese heritage. Apart from that, my grandpa doesn't really, I guess, observe other sorts of things. He loves Australia and he's very much, he's become very much all about the 'Australian life,' whatever that is. I don't know. He likes a lot of sport. Is that the Australian life? Is that what makes someone Australian? Yeah so, Chinese New Year is sort of the time for us every year, like we sort of all get together and, you know, over the course of a couple of weeks or whatever. And it's kind of where we all, we always just basically learn off of Clarence, my grandpa, who is always, he's always just got a story to tell. Usually it's like about the mythical Chinese zodiac and the story of the rat and the ox and the tiger and the rabbit and the race that led to what is now known as the Chinese zodiac and stuff. And he talks us through the elements, which is like a new layer of Chinese zodiac, because there's like... You can be an ox, but you can be a fire. And that has different meanings to being a water ox or a metal ox. Like there's like five elements and then twelve animals. So every 60 years it lands on the same element and animal. So the 60th birthday is the huge thing. And so, yeah, we've always just got something to learn off of Clarence. Unfortunately my grandma doesn't really do, apart from cooking, she doesn't really do any sort of Italian traditions. I mean, she is very Catholic so Christmas is her sort of thing. So there's that sort of thing. But she moved to Australia with her mother when she was 4 years old. So she speaks Italian, but she has a very, she has an Australian accent... And a lot of her relatives got out of Italy at the end of the war, as well. So some of them are in Melbourne, some of them are back in Italy, some of them are in Slovenia. So they're sort of spread out, whereas all of Clarence's original family is back in Hong Kong. So, moving back, it has been... That has been one of the most, one of my favourite things about moving back, to be honest. You know, I think just getting to see my grandpa a lot and getting to spend time with him and go to the footy with him... Things that I didn't get to do in Melbourne has been just really great. It's been very healing.

Bronte:
Is there something that you, you kind of struggle with in the creative industries?

Lachie:
In terms of being from a mixed race background or just in general?

Bronte:
Just in general.

Lachie:
Yeah. I mean, yeah. The reason why I guess I asked is because that was kind of the first thing that came into my head. So I think I'll probably talk about that. Because I guess, you know, I'm very proud of being a mixed race person and I'm so proud of my grandparents for being a Italian woman and a Chinese man in the 50s in Australia, which was super white Australia, super racist, you know. Yeah. Basically, my grandma was working as a nurse, as a nurse in Parramatta. My grandpa was working for the Department of Defence. And so a lot of people told my grandma, "what are you doing? Like, why? Why are you seeing this guy? There's so many guys, so many great guys that you could be with... Why this one?" And so, I'm proud of them for ignoring all of that and for being happy. The interesting thing for the industry, for me, I think at the moment, which I think it's getting better, but I think it still has work to do, obviously... Is - and writers are doing this more and more - is just like, creating roles that are not black and white, and families that aren't black and white. Like an Asian person doesn't have to marry an Asian person and have full Asian kids. Like more and more there are mixed race. And often when I look at a casting and I see any race, it usually is directed towards either a white person or an Asian person. And so for me, I guess, I identify as a person of colour and I don't identify necessarily as a white person or as an Asian person. And so, in a way, I am both, but I'm also neither. And so there's sort of like, this third thing, that sort of just is separate from either of them. And so, yeah. It really only, like when I go for castings that are... Where race isn't really mentioned. That's when I feel like I have a chance of getting the role. Because if they say Caucasian, my agent will put me up for it. But I'm like, "am I what you're looking for?" So I've been put up for also Asian castings. And sometimes that feels like, I feel like a bit of an imposter in the room because I'm sort of like, I don't... Like I'm a young actor and I want this role because I want to further my career. But I also don't, I shouldn't represent the Asian experience because I'm not a product of the Asian experience. I have a privileged life and all of the aspects of white male privilege apply to me. The only thing that doesn't is, I guess, how I look and who my grandpa is. And so, and that doesn't affect... Like that's not, I haven't had negative experiences with race in my general life because I have an Australian accent and I like going to the footy. And so apart from my slightly thinner eyes and slightly more tan skin, I can 'pass' as a - I don't even know if this feels right to say - but like, I can 'pass as a white person, you know what I mean? It's just that, it's just the sort of thing that I think that, mainstream writing and producers need to take into consideration with roles, because literally anyone can look like anything now, regardless of what their parents look like, regardless of brothers and sisters, and siblings can look completely different because their parents might look completely different and, you know, different genetic makeups or whatever. And that's beautiful. I think that's beautiful that like, you know, I want to live in a world where you don't immediately identify that someone is related to someone else because they look exactly the same. Like, that's just, it's so boring.

Bronte:
Oh my God, it's so funny you say that. I literally look like a spitting image of my mother and my brothers. We look like we are so related.

Lachie:
I mean, I think I might have worded it, sort of, in a way that makes it sound like in real life that's a bad thing. Like that's not a bad thing. I think just the possibility of anything is what excites me.

Bronte:
Yeah, for sure. And you're right. It is, that is a true representation of real life for so many people. And the fact that it's taking so long and it's kind of like, the stories that have that honesty and truth in the representation of people come from so many different places, that's kind of like put on a pedestal to be like, "look at this one piece of theatre that is doing this!" Whereas it should just be, it should just be ALL of the writing and all of the theatre and all of the film and TV that we ingest as viewers and as people in this world. All of it should just be very inclusive and diverse because that's what we are as a true, real society. As a real representation of the world.

Lachie:
You say that again!

Bronte:
That's a real struggle though, Lachie. I just want to like, I know you kind of question it at the start, but that's a real thing. And thank you for saying that. You're very articulate and I'm loving it.

Lachie:
No worries. Hey, any time.

Bronte:
It's really nice to hear you talk like this.

Lachie:
Thanks. This is lovely by the way. This is a lovely experience.

Bronte:
I don't really feel like we've had this. I don't feel like we've had conversations like this before. You know, it's like, it's something that doesn't always come up in...

Lachie:
You're not just going to be sitting around and start opening up about your struggles with racial identity.

Bronte:
Yeah that's it. And especially, you know, with me as someone who is a white woman, it's not necessarily something that you would sit down with me and be like, "hey, Bronte, you know that race struggle that we have?" Like, that's not something that you would do with me necessarily. But I really appreciate you sharing with me. And that's, it's an important thing to be to be said and to be heard. I'm going to get into some mildly quickfire questions... They're not actually super quickfire... I should stop calling them that because they tend to have the longest answers!

Lachie:
Let's do it! It makes it sound so exciting! "Quickfire!"

Bronte:
And then, maybe we'll get into a little bit of music. A bit of jamming. I'm not going to sing.

Lachie:
Beautiful. Cool. The only reason you're not is because the lag would be strange. But if we were in the same room, you'd be singing.

Bronte:
Oh, I don't think so. Unless you're playing some Cher... Not for me. Ok, so! Do you have something in your day that you just have to do and if you don't do it, you don't feel right?

Lachie:
I mean, it's boring And it's very much something you probably already knew. But I think, something musical. Like I don't know, it's either playing my guitar for five minutes at the very least, or if I'm, you know, somewhere where I don't have my guitar, it's either singing or something rhythmic. Just making anything into drums like, music has to be part of my day. And not just listening to it, like creating it in whatever form. That is what I have to do each day.

Bronte:
Do you have a daily practice?

Lachie:
Not really. I mean if I'm completely honest. And all of my drama school teachers are going to be going, "Argh!" Yeah, I'm just, I'm not great at routine if I'm completely honest. And I think, I really respect everyone who does have a daily practice. I think it's phenomenal. I see the value in it. I just think that it goes back to just, I'm just so easy breezy, go where the wind takes me.

Bronte:
How did you... How do you, if you do have a routine, I know you don't work a 9-5, but like when... Oh my God, come on, man.

Lachie:
The cat's back... Just so that everyone knows what's going on.

Bronte:
I've got a hot water - Sorry - I've got a hot water bottle on my belly and Viggo finds me whenever I have it and he just sits on the hot water bottle. So he's going to be here for the rest of the chat.

Lachie:
That's good. You can listen to some music Viggo.

Bronte:
Yeah, he's very needy. Oh my God. What were we saying? Oh, I was...

Lachie:
Daily practice!

Bronte:
Yes, I didn't necessarily expect you to have one. Like, I don't see you as someone that kind of like, thrives on routine. Because you are so easy breezy. But when we were at VCA and maybe even when you were at school... Like, how did that work for you? Did you feel a bit confined by that consistency?

Lachie:
Yeah, I guess... I guess I think, you know, I did feel confined, but at the same time being forced - or not forced - but having to, sort of, having to do it I think was in a way good for me. It was like good for me and bad for me. It was good for me because it just, like, kept me focussed, I guess. And, you know, while there were times where I just hated it and wanted to get out of there, I was sort of able to look back and see that it was probably good for me. I mean, honestly, I think it was less confining than it would have been if I was, you know, going to lectures and sitting in a... Because every day, even though it was a schedule and it was a 9-5 location based thing, and I had to be there... We were doing different things every day. And I walked into the room just like, it was a possibility, like we really didn't know what we were going to be doing a lot of the time. So the element of surprise, I guess, is what drove me. Yeah, the element of surprise drove me through drama school.

Bronte:
What's the thing that you're most proud of that you've done in your creative career so far?

Lachie:
Probably a play that I did, it was an independent play that I did at the start of this year, literally in February we closed and then pretty much COVID took over. So very lucky that we got a full season in. And it was at the New Theatre in Newtown called Angry Fags, and it was their Mardi Gras play. And it was very much a play about oppression in the LGBTIQA+ community. And it was kind of about taking, the characters taking action into their own hands because they're fed up with the government. Set in America as well, set in Trump's America as well, and set in Atlanta, Georgia, in Trump's America. So it was very much an oppressive location for the LGBT community. And the character that I played in it was a gay character who kind of, leads a lot of the action against the government named Cooper Harlow. And he was very sort of, a very feminine, flamboyant kind of character. And when I first sort of got the role, I guess a lot of things went through my head like, I was excited to get the role. But I also wanted to make sure that I wasn't going to be creating a caricature and that I truly kind of understood the gay experience, especially in the States and especially in Atlanta. And so that rehearsal process for me was really, I'm really proud of that rehearsal experience because I didn't have all the answers on day one of rehearsals, which kind of scared me. Because often I just like to have a role that I think, you know, obviously I'll rehearse to make it as refined as possible, but I want to have a lot of answers on day one of rehearsals. And so it was scary for me. I was working with a director who was a gay man. The actor I was working with was a gay man. A lot of the crew were part of the LGBT community. And so I just wanted to make sure that I was going to do the role justice. And also it was their Mardi Gras show. So most of the nights our audiences were LGBT community. And so I'm proud because I just, I was learning every day. I was researching. I was learning things in myself. I was learning things about the character. And I'm proud because I think - I know - that I created a three dimensional character with experiences and who was a worthy representation of that experience. And the audiences loved it. So that's good as well. I could have just given a super entertaining performance, and that wouldn't have been enough. And I think that's what I'm learning, is that... When I first came to drama school out of high school, doing theatre at an all boys private school, it was just like, "OK, be entertaining and get the laughs from the crowd." But yeah, it was just a way for me to see how much I've learnt about myself and about performance over my four years since the before time, since before VCA.

Bronte:
Last question...

Lachie:
Yeah, you're totally right about this not-quickfire thing.

Bronte:
I know. I don't know why I call them quickfire fire.

Lachie:
No! Keep calling them quickfire. Because it's funny. It's ironic.

Bronte:
Up the excitement!

Lachie:
It's ironic. And I love that.

Bronte:
What brings you joy creatively?

Lachie:
I mean, I don't know, all of it. Like, just creating. Like just living a life that allows me to create and to perform and to put things into the world that didn't exist before. Yeah. So much brings me joy creatively. It is joy. I don't know how else to answer that, really. Creativity is joy. And anyone who doesn't have creativity in their lives, I can understand why they're not happy people. I can understand why some politicians would rather be miserable and see joyful people upset because they don't have creativity in their lives and so they don't understand what a joyful life it can be.

Bronte:
Ok, so I'm super excited that you are going with me on my wanting you to perform. Like, let's be honest, it's just so that I get a moment of you serenading me privately, but...

Lachie:
That's exactly right. Until you release this episode and it's public.

Bronte:
And then it's for everyone. So, yeah. Lachie you're going to sing slash play something. Talk about it. Tell me about it.

Lachie:
Yeah. Yeah. OK, so we've talked a lot about The Tints on this show and I've played a lot of Tints songs acoustically and stuff recently just trying to promote our EP and stuff like that. So I actually thought that I wouldn't play a Tints song today. I thought I'd play something else. It is still original. It's something that I wrote towards the end of last year that I have only ever performed at this solo gig I did opening for my friend's band in front of about 20 people. So not a lot of people have heard this song. It's actually in the genre of hip hop/rap and I wrote it last year. I was in the audition process for Hamilton in Sydney. And so I got super into rap and stuff after that and I ended up writing some stuff. Yeah. So this song is called Wrong. It's about asking, where did it go wrong? Where did it go wrong that a world full of good people - because I believe that people are inherently good - Where did it go wrong that a world full of good people turned to hate?

Where did it go wrong? When did we fall under the spell That makes a world full of good people look for reasons to repel? Are you looking out for your loves? But not looking out for mine? Or just feeling so nostalgic, dreaming of a better time... Who do we blame when it all falls apart? Where would you punch the mirror and cut your fists with shards of glass? I know it's scary having to talk to people that aren't exactly the same. But is it worth it? Making children feel worthless and ashamed for being who they are? If it's all they're being just like you and I were taught to be or maybe you weren't. Maybe you had it drilled into you that you love the colour blue and violence and defending your honour and having sex no matter the cost. No matter what people will have lost as long as your other insecure friends don't think that you're soft. As long as you walk into a room and get exactly what you want because that's what people do just to feel like they belong. Where did it go wrong? When did we fall under the spell that makes a world full of good people who look for reasons to repel? Are you looking out for your loves? But not looking out for mine? Or just feeling so nostalgic, and dreaming of a less equal time... And then there's power. Let's talk about power for just a minute. What is it? Is it sitting on a chair where people have to bow to you when they visit? And if it's such a special chair how can we keep putting the wrong people in it? Safety and ignorance The ones that preach hate to stay silent Rather than the ones who unite us and hate on violence? I can't deny it. I may have voted against it, but I love democracy. So I understand that every complaint is hypocrisy. But honestly, what happened to the people that I know exist out there? The ones that love their neighbours, who never take and always share We can't be the minority, standing up for poverty And camaraderie in this completely random lottery Yet people still sing "life go on" Well, what is all for? "The world still spins" Yeah but how much longer for? And when it's all over, what will we have fought for If you stand for nothing, sir? What have we fought for? Where did it go wrong? When did we fall under the spell? That makes a world full of good people look for reasons to repel? Where did it go wrong? Where did we start to lose our way? What made a world of loving people look for people that hate?

Bronte:
Thanks, Lachie.

Lachie:
Thanks! So yeah. Until then, that hasn't been played... I've played it once, yeah at a bar and people were talking, so I don't think they really fully heard the lyrics anyway, but yeah. So, thanks for giving me the opportunity to play it because it doesn't, it's not the sound of The Tints. We are very much an indie rock band, so I'm not really pulling those ones out at gigs. But it's exciting just to sort of have platforms to be able to play stuff outside of that as well. Because I love writing all genres. So thanks.

Bronte:
Yeah, no that was such a treat to listen to. It's always so lovely to listen to you sing and play and it's so warm and fuzzy. Thanks Lachie. Thanks for coming on and having a big old chat with me. It's been a treat. Is there anything that you feel like you need to say that you haven't said yet? Just get it out...

Lachie:
Nope! I've said it all. That's it. Got nothing else. This guy's done.

Bronte:
This week, I wanted to recommend a book called Trauma Cleaner. The Trauma Cleaner is a book written by Sarah Krasnostein about a woman called Sandra Pankhurst. The book is called Trauma Cleaner essentially because that is exactly what Sandra does, she cleans areas that have faced trauma, in a way. So places where people have died, murder scenes, drug scenes, hoarders houses, all sorts of houses that have seen trauma. This book is a telling of Sandra's life. Before she was a trauma cleaner, Sandra was a husband, a father, a drag queen, a sex reassignment patient, she was a sex worker, a business worker, she now runs her own business as a trauma cleaner... It's just a really incredible book. And for my Australian listeners, all of it is based in Australia. So Sandra came out as gay in the 70s in Australia. I mean, that was a super dangerous time to be openly gay. It was illegal. So, she's faced a lot of dangerous things and traumatic things that the title... The title has the word trauma in it, so essentially content warnings for this book are sexual assault, rape and homophobia. If these things are something that you really don't want to be reading about, particularly in a time like now, when there's not a lot of space for distraction in everyday life. Maybe leave this one for another time or maybe it's not for you. But for me it was incredibly educational learning about life for someone who is gay and trans in a time that it was, you know, before 2020 when these things are so much more accepted within society. And I mean, you know, for most people safer now than it was 50 years ago. It's a beautiful book. It's a beautiful retelling of a life. It is incredibly educational and quite hard to read at points. There was a chapter I read and then I literally had to put it down for a week and just give myself a break from the very vivid storytelling that Sarah creates. It's just, I think just one of those books that when you read you start to see this whole other world, especially if you're not a part of the LGBTQ community, or if you're like me and you were born in the 90s, and you weren't alive in the 70s and 80s in Australia when these things were still illegal. Yeah, it gets to the end of the book and there's just really fascinating chats with Sandra about how she identifies now. Essentially no one in her life knows that she was assigned male at birth. And for her, her life has moved so far away from what it was in the 70s and 80s... It's just a fascinating retelling of her life. And I really, really strongly recommend reading the Trauma Cleaner. And if you do, let me know what you think. I have a bunch of books that I really want to recommend and I'm super keen to start a book club, but I'm such a slow reader that I'm like, I would start it and then everyone would be like, "I'm finished." I'd be like, "OK. And I'm at chapter three." Anywho... The Trauma Cleaner, by Sarah Krasnostein about Sandra Pankhurst. It's intense and beautiful and educational and heavy. It's really heavy, but I loved it. And if you're within my 5KM radius, holler and I can drop it in your mailbox. Have a wonderful day. I hope the sun is shining. Stay creative. Chats with Creatives is produced by Anahata Collective. Music is by the wonderfully talented Rick Scully. Please rate, review, subscribe. Let me know how you like it. Let me know your thoughts. Holler if you want to chat. I'll catch you next week.

Bronte:
Yeah, bye!

Lachie:
Bye... No, you hang up first.

Bronte:
No stop it, you do it... OK I'll do it.

Lachie:
You do it.

Bronte:
I'll do it. Sthap!

Lachie:
Okay I'm leaving this meeting. I've got, I've got shit to do. I'm leaving this -

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RESOURCES 

• The Tints
  @thetintstheband

  For a little taste of The Tints check out Blame (official Video)

• Angry Fags by Topher Payne at the NEW THEATRE

• GET ON IT: Trauma Cleaner by Sarah Krasnostein

Head over to the @chats.w.creatives instagram page to stay up to date with episodes and guests we have coming up!

Follow our host Bronte Charlotte on Instagram @bronteandsunshine

Follow this week's guest Lachie Pringle on instagram @all.the.pringle.ladies

Produced by Anahata Collective @anahata_collective

Music by Rick Scully